NO More classic comic 3 pack

[nando]

What happend , hasbro forgot about gunho , crimson twins , air tight , quick kick , cover girl , falcon , doc come on theres more characters that will kick ass with a new head design ... :)

[Jay]

Considering they cancelled DTC's fourth wave of single-pack figures to make way for the 25th anniversary crap, wouldn't surprise me if comic packs are on indefinite hiatus too.

Besides, the molds for Gung-Ho, Doc, Falcon and Cover Girl have been lost for over a decade (Doc's mold was lost BEFORE 1988! :eek: ) so I wouldn't expect comic pack figures for them anyway.

[General Scarlett]

That's just such a pi$$er...................................... :(

[rds13601]

Hasbro would make a killing if they did 3 packs with the original 13 Joes in a darker, more realistic green version. I.E. Flash, Grunt, Doc, etc. Just an idea Hasbro.

[Jay]

[QUOTE=rds13601]Hasbro would make a killing if they did 3 packs with the original 13 Joes in a darker, more realistic green version. I.E. Flash, Grunt, Doc, etc. Just an idea Hasbro.[/QUOTE]
Once again, the mold for Doc has been lost since the mid-80s, and Flash's mold has gone AWOL too, why do you think he got left out of the Stars & Stripes Forever set in 1997 and the dead Breaker took his place?

[General Scarlett]

WTF?!?!?!?! Why do they keep the most obsure, ridiculous crap around & lose or misplace things that would actually make money??



Aaaahhhh yes----because that would make sense...........

[Jay]

[QUOTE=General Scarlett]WTF?!?!?!?! Why do they keep the most obsure, ridiculous crap around & lose or misplace things that would actually make money??



Aaaahhhh yes----because that would make sense...........[/QUOTE]
It's not like they do it on purpose. The mold becomes too worn out to be used, or it's lost during a transfer from a factory to Hasbro's creative team, or something happens to it and it gets misplaced...
There are rumors that a sunken ship has cost the molds of a large amount of Battle Corps figures including Dr. Mindbender, who re-used the waist and legs of the original 1986 Vipers. This is why every single Viper since 1997 has been using the 1986 BAT's waist and legs instead.

[General Scarlett]

I hear what your saying Jay, but still I have a hard time understanding WHY they LET things like this happen. I mean, if you know that the mold is getting worn down, manufacture a new one!! If you have to transport them, do it by FedEx or UPS Ground or Air.......something that is traceable.

I mean, it's like such a common sense thing to me...........but I am a woman after all.................
So give them to me!! I won't lose 'em & I'll make sure that new molds are cast BEFORE they get too worn out!!!

[Jay]

[QUOTE=General Scarlett]I hear what your saying Jay, but still I have a hard time understanding WHY they LET things like this happen. I mean, if you know that the mold is getting worn down, manufacture a new one!! If you have to transport them, do it by FedEx or UPS Ground or Air.......something that is traceable.

I mean, it's like such a common sense thing to me...........but I am a woman after all.................
So give them to me!! I won't lose 'em & I'll make sure that new molds are cast BEFORE they get too worn out!!![/QUOTE]
Manufacturing new molds costs a big chunk of money. Money Hasbro isn't willing to put into GIJoe because simply put, it's not a very popular line, by comparison of lines like Justice League, Transformers, Power Rangers and whatever anime happens to be the trendy thing at the moment.

Lost molds is no recent thing. Both Hasbro and Takara have lost countless molds for old Transformers, even Mirage and Sunstreaker. I'm pretty sure every single mold for Super Powers has become a thing of the past.

These molds change hands so often and are so often moved around that there's always a strong risk they'll get lost.

Heck, the 1983 Original 13 waist and legs were used back in 2003 on a figure, yet by 2004 when the comic packs were released, they were lost and Hasbro had to make up for it by using a 1986 Roadblock waist and 1991 General Hawk legs...

[General Scarlett]

How these @$$holes can make so much money is so beyond me................

I wish that someone would post the blueprints for the original molds on Ebay or something..........

Or I should just take a class to learn how to make 'em myself-then all of us here could make as many customs & crap that we want!!!! HEY NOW!!!!!! That's not a half bad idea!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Jay]

[QUOTE=General Scarlett]How these @$$holes can make so much money is so beyond me................

I wish that someone would post the blueprints for the original molds on Ebay or something..........

Or I should just take a class to learn how to make 'em myself-then all of us here could make as many customs & crap that we want!!!! HEY NOW!!!!!! That's not a half bad idea!!!!!!!!!!!!!!![/QUOTE]
Why do they make money? It's simple... it's because a lot of us fans buy the product even when we're not that crazy about it. Why would they bother to remake the molds of the 83 figures' waists and legs when we'll still buy the comic pack figures with non-fitting waists and legs?

[General Scarlett]

It is indeed a twisted web we as collectors are entangled in that the manufacturer's have got us by the short hairs so tightly that we'll buy anything connected to our passions just to ensure the continuation of the line..........

[Sonneilon]

It's hard to say what the future of 3 packs are now. There is a possibility they'll return IF...

IF the 25th Joes don't go so well, Hasbro will need to find another way to make things work. Return to what works, it's possible.

If the 25th Joes DO well, then we can expect more and I'm guessing that they'll be in the new designed style. it's pretty much agreed that this is the last hard push for 3.75" for the time being.

[Outrider]

[QUOTE=Sonneilon]It's hard to say what the future of 3 packs are now.[/QUOTE]

I hate to be a killjoy, but I have a horrible feeling the 25th stuff will not sell well, and that will be the death knell for our 3 3/4" buddies. The fact that wave four was cancelled, and no new vehicles are proposed speaks volumes. :(

[Jay]

[QUOTE=Outrider]I hate to be a killjoy, but I have a horrible feeling the 25th stuff will not sell well, and that will be the death knell for our 3 3/4" buddies. The fact that wave four was cancelled, and no new vehicles are proposed speaks volumes. :([/QUOTE]
I have to agree with Craig, sadly... :(

[Sonneilon]

But the point is, if it don't do well, then Hasbro needs to figure out another solution. They should really look at continuing or bringing back the comic packs if the 25th doesn't do hot.

I would worry more that the future comic packs would have the 25D articulation.

[Red Sox]

[QUOTE=Jay]Considering they cancelled DTC's fourth wave of single-pack figures to make way for the 25th anniversary crap, wouldn't surprise me if comic packs are on indefinite hiatus too.

Besides, the molds for Gung-Ho, Doc, Falcon and Cover Girl have been lost for over a decade (Doc's mold was lost BEFORE 1988! :eek: ) so I wouldn't expect comic pack figures for them anyway.[/QUOTE]

I'm curious as to how the Doc, Falcon, GH, and Cover Girl molds were lost, do you have any more info on this? I know that the V1 Cobra Commander, V2 SE, and some others supposedly went down in a ship, but I haven't heard about those others.

[Jay]

[QUOTE=Red Sox]I'm curious as to how the Doc, Falcon, GH, and Cover Girl molds were lost, do you have any more info on this? I know that the V1 Cobra Commander, V2 SE, and some others supposedly went down in a ship, but I haven't heard about those others.[/QUOTE]
Doc was lost for years. He shared his waist and arms with Duke, and when time came to release Tiger Force Duke in 1988, the Doc mold was gone, supposedly lost in South America. So Hasbro had to make due using Hit'N'Run arms and a Cobra Trooper waist.
Falcon's lower body was lost when Battle Corps Leatherneck's lower body was lost. I heard that after his 2003 release, the upper body mold was lost as well. Either way, it's no big loss as the v1 Falcon is still the perfect representation of the character.
Gung-Ho's mold was supposedly lost after his 1997 re-release. His lower arms and his waist survived through the 1997-AntiVenom-HAS-ComicPack Duke mold, but other than that...
Cover Girl, much like Doc, lost her mold loooong ago in South America.

[rds13601]

You'd think Hasbro would have insured the molds because they are a money maker. DUH!!

[Jay]

[QUOTE=rds13601]You'd think Hasbro would have insured the molds because they are a money maker. DUH!![/QUOTE]
Uh...huh.... I have no idea what the hell you meant.

Another thing you guys should consider. It costs a LOT of money to remake a mold. A lot! Hasbro's better off financially finding replacement parts instead.... they just need to put more thought into their replacement parts, IMO.

[rds13601]

Usually business firms take out insurance policies on things that make them money. The business will pay a monthly fee. When the item is stolen or lost the insurance company will write a check to the business that pays the monthly fee minus a deductible. A deductible is how much the business that pays the monthly fee has to pay to replace the lost or stolen item. The insurance company will write a check for the remainder of the cost to replace the lost or stolen item. Insurance is the biggest rip off industry in America because in order to have an item insured, you have to pay a monthly policy and might never have to file a lost or stolen claim with the insurance company. Its like flushing your money down a toliet. Hope it helps a little.

[Sonneilon]

It's hard to say what Hasbro was doing back in the day.

[Stormer]

Insurance: institutionalised gambling.

You: "Bet you my house burns down this month."

Insurance company: "Bet it doesn't."

Then maybe, one day...

You: "Yay, my home burned to the ground! I win!"

[Red Sox]

Insurance companies don't like when you actually use your insurance either. I've heard stories of people having thier insurance cancelled because they used it. They love to take your money but they don't want to give it back. :mad:

Back on topic: It's a shame that Hasbro took such poor care of these classic molds and we'll never have the chance to see these figures re-issued. I will miss the comic packs, and we never got proper versions of Grunt, Grand Slam, Flash, Torch, etc. in comic pack form. :(

[nando]

are u sure that the gunho s mold is missing check out the comic 3 pack Duke , THE SAME LEGGS AND ARMS from gun ho v1 ...

[Jay]

[QUOTE=nando]are u sure that the gunho s mold is missing check out the comic 3 pack Duke , THE SAME LEGGS AND ARMS from gun ho v1 ...[/QUOTE]
Yes, I'm sure.
First of all, Duke only shares his LOWER LEGS with v1 Gung-Ho, and it's been like that since 1983. Second of all, Duke has been sharing the same LOWER ARMS (the upper arms are different) with Gung-Ho, as well as the waist, since 1997 because back then Gung-Ho's mold wasn't lost, and since it was back in Hasbro's possession for the 1997 release, so they used parts of it for Duke too since he didn't have his lower arms or his waist. Now the rest of Gung-Ho's mold is history.

I even said it a few posts back, don't you read??

[QUOTE=Jay]Gung-Ho's mold was supposedly lost after his 1997 re-release. His lower arms and his waist survived through the 1997-AntiVenom-HAS-ComicPack Duke mold, but other than that...[/QUOTE]

[ToneGunsRevisited]

[QUOTE=Red Sox]Grunt, Grand Slam, Flash, Torch, etc. in comic pack form. :([/QUOTE]
I don't see problem with Grunt. Take the actual comic pack head with Col. Hawk/Stalker/Zap's comic pack body.

But I've to totally agree in Flash and Grand Slam. And G, the actual comic pack space Flash doesn't count :p. This 2 guys need to see a comic pack as well as Major Bludd, Low Light (why not?) and some others. All with retooled heads of course.

[ender098]

[QUOTE=Red Sox]I'm curious as to how the Doc, Falcon, GH, and Cover Girl molds were lost, do you have any more info on this? I know that the V1 Cobra Commander, V2 SE, and some others supposedly went down in a ship, but I haven't heard about those others.[/QUOTE]


You know what I'm curiuos about? How they can't figure out how to go on ebay, buy a vintage figure and make a mold from him! GTG Customs and Alyoshas customs aren't multimillion dollar companies and they can make replacement mold parts! Hasbro is full of shit! It wouldn't take that much, except for the fact that they won't be an overnight multimillion dollar sucess, so if it doesn't insure that Hasbro execs are up to their eyeballs in Benz's and Bahamian Vactions, screw it!



[QUOTE=Outrider]I hate to be a killjoy, but I have a horrible feeling the 25th stuff will not sell well, and that will be the death knell for our 3 3/4" buddies. The fact that wave four was cancelled, and no new vehicles are proposed speaks volumes. :([/QUOTE]


Yeah, they'll put it on the collectors sites, and on HAsbro.com but will you see any TV commercials about it? nope. Any media coverage? Nope! Any she-bang like they had when the line launched 25 years ago? Nope, then they'll use the crappy sales as a reason to cancel the line. If they don't put the stuff in TRU or WalMart, it will go the way of DTC!

I'll say it now;

Here Lies the 3 3/4 inch GI Joe line. They gave
their lives so capitalistic greedy conglomerate
toy manufacturers could drive sports cars and
send their kids to private schools.

R.I.P
1982 - 2007





AND YES, THAT'S HOW I REALLY FEEL!!!!!! :mad:

[Jay]

[QUOTE=ender098]You know what I'm curiuos about? How they can't figure out how to go on ebay, buy a vintage figure and make a mold from him! GTG Customs and Alyoshas customs aren't multimillion dollar companies and they can make replacement mold parts! Hasbro is full of shit! It wouldn't take that much, except for the fact that they won't be an overnight multimillion dollar sucess, so if it doesn't insure that Hasbro execs are up to their eyeballs in Benz's and Bahamian Vactions, screw it! [/QUOTE]
Yes, and Alyosha's unpainted, unpackaged figure costs between 35 and 50$, plus shipping. Add in painting and packaging costs and you're looking at VERY expensive figures.
Are you willing to spend that much on a new figure?

[Sonneilon]

Jay said it. The guys who do special molds charge a lot. The fact is, it's not that much to do them. But it's a niche market and they can charge what they want. Phu, who used to hang here, broke down the costs of Alyosha's figures he was selling at the Con and he figured they were priced twice as much as the cost of them. Now, you can say that they are actual art pieces as compared to a toy figure for playing with, but in the end, $65 for a figure is a lot.

[ender098]

yes, but with things like buying in bulk wholesale and things of that nature, they can do it. Alyosha is a one man shop. If he had 1,000 employees and a manufacturing machinery, he could drop the price by making stuff in bulk. But there's not enough of a market for his goods in the mainstream.

How can Hasbro sell figures for $6.00 a piece? they have the manufacturing resources that Aloysha and GTG customs don't!

[Sonneilon]

Keep in mind too that Alyosha is infringing on Hasbro's rights. He said that if Hasbro comes down on him, he'll change the names of the figures. ;)

[Uncle Flint]

To kinda of get back to the original topic, I can't see anymore comic packs. Hasbro is in business to make money. The 3 3/4 stuff wasn't selling well so the line got canceled. Hasbro recognized that although the line wasn't selling well, they had a small loyal group of collectors. Hasbro understood that we collectors have very different tastes than the kids to whom they were marketing the toys. The result was the DTC line, which was designed with collectors in mind. lThe survival of the DTC line was totally in our own hands, but as it turned out we didn't buy enough and the line got canceled. We can't blame hasbro for not continuing to make and sell figures at a financial loss. But we can blame them the non-existent marketing, the horrible distribution problems. TRU distribution of GI Joe product is a joke. My local TRU never got the two six packs last fall, or the last two comic packs. And they only got a handful of the DTC figures. When you can't get your product to the shelves its not gonna sell.

I think the 3 3/4 line is dead unless the 25th stuff does really well and I don't see that happening.

[ender098]

[QUOTE=Uncle Flint]To kinda of get back to the original topic, I can't see anymore comic packs. Hasbro is in business to make money. The 3 3/4 stuff wasn't selling well so the line got canceled. Hasbro recognized that although the line wasn't selling well, they had a small loyal group of collectors. Hasbro understood that we collectors have very different tastes than the kids to whom they were marketing the toys. The result was the DTC line, which was designed with collectors in mind. lThe survival of the DTC line was totally in our own hands, but as it turned out we didn't buy enough and the line got canceled. We can't blame hasbro for not continuing to make and sell figures at a financial loss. But we can blame them the non-existent marketing, the horrible distribution problems. TRU distribution of GI Joe product is a joke. My local TRU never got the two six packs last fall, or the last two comic packs. And they only got a handful of the DTC figures. When you can't get your product to the shelves its not gonna sell.

I think the 3 3/4 line is dead unless the 25th stuff does really well and I don't see that happening.[/QUOTE]



Hasbro used DTC to say to collectors, "See, there's not enough of you guys to justify keeping the "3.75" line alive." They put it online because they knew that unlike being in a store where a kid can see it and beg a parent for it (thus generate "non-collector" sales) the parents usually don't impulse buy stuff for kids online. They knew from the begining we could never carry the line. You're right, crappy distribution, no marketing, they set it up for failure!

What killes me is how they claim the S6 is selling. It must be selling somewhere other than Southern California. Everytime I walk into TRU, the shevles are loaded with S6, but all the 3.75 stuff is sold out! maybe they just have a ton of S6 stock, but I see more kids on my block playing with 3.75 inch then S6. I guess it's easier to sell 1 $15.00 figure in 3 days and say it's selling vs. selling 3 $5.99 figures a day! I dunno. I'm glad I'm not in business! LOL!

[phu]

I think many of us overestimate the degree to which we affect Hasbro. ;)

[Flint]

I say just make new molds and keep us fans Happy & Broke!!! ;)

[rds13601]

I say to Hasbro, keep the assembly line of sh*t coming!! If it doesn't sell, it'll probably be a collector's item.

[Lava Boss]

[QUOTE=Uncle Flint]To kinda of get back to the original topic, I can't see anymore comic packs. Hasbro is in business to make money. The 3 3/4 stuff wasn't selling well so the line got canceled. .[/QUOTE]

No, 3 3/4" just wasn't a break-out super hit. I've heard that VvsV did decent business. Hasbro wanted major business and something that Wal-Mart, the bully of retail, would go for. Hence Sigma Six, which originally was the replacement for 12" Joes, became the "it" brand that Hasbro focused all significant Gi JOE funding on.

But that's what I heard. I'm not a market analyst industry expert, and I'm bit tired of every other fan acting like an arm chair economics and marketing expert.

[BADBLUDD]

IMO, the market forces are too great for Hasbro to keep GI Joe 3.75" going forever, despite the strong loyalty of fans. Action figures as a whole are selling less and less each year replaced by XBoxes and Playstations. Star Wars 3.75" figures are starting to fade, and with the end of all the Star Wars movies, the pressure of cheap imitations from China, I don't see any reason to think that the GI Joe 3.75" line will continue forever. The reason that Hasbro may have even re-designed and brought out the 25th Anniversary guys is for collectors--- I doubt they really have any great visions of sales beyond the core collectors and a few other impulse shoppers.

[Sonneilon]

I meant to comment on this a few days ago. LavaBoss pretty much hit it on the head. VvV sold well. Or sold evenly. The problem is that GI Joe Hasbro wanted everything done in a very short amount of time. If their 100,000 units didn't sell in one month, they were pissed. Doesn't matter if it sold over 2 months. 3 months. 6 months. They wanted an overnite success. I don't know WHY they felt they need a 'flash in the pan' type of sales. Maybe it was Walmart.

Sigma6 ended up being the next theme. They still wanted instant, over-nite sales. Did they get it? Nope. But I think S6 did better at the start than VvV. And it's strong enough to give up the S6 theme and go 3 directions! But here's the kicker. Hit the link and scroll down a tiny and check out the new packaging!

April's wave of Soldiers (http://www.joebattlelines.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=10193)