Well my opinion is this.

Ok, I have a certain amount of O Rings that i am able to get my hands on. And the older Joes looked awesome and i am glad that they are redoing the original joes for guys to buy what they have missed out.
But alas, I wish they would atop with thw god forsaken repaints!

Well the problem with being objective is the question is how do you 'FEEL" about the 25th figures. Also no matter what all opinions are subjective, there is no objective point of view to be taken with this line of questioning. The very nature of opinions is subjective.

Still I have to say I like some, and dislike others. There is really no univeral "WOW" to the figures. Some I am very impressed with, Nemisis Eforcer (Imortal I know) is one of the best figures I have seen in years, while he is packaged with Falcon who could easily be a whipping boy for everything that is wrong with this line.

My one major glaring complaint would have to be the chest joint, not that it is there, but that it has that oddball hump in so many figures that, well, is just ugly (the aforementioned Falcon, or Duke or Shipwreck are prime examples of figures that are ruined by this design, otherwise they would be incredible figures). Now why hasbro chose this design is beyond me since many companies had already done the same joint without any kind of hump or disruption (ie Microman, Superhero showdown, even hasbro itself did a darth maul with the same joint again without the "Hump").

At first one might think its something artistic or limit of design, Until you look at Storm Shadow, Destro (either version) or Nemisis enforcer and note again that there is no hump in any of those figures. It does beg the question as to why it is there.

Still some manage to work around it somehow (ie Roadblock and Snake Eyes) and be pretty good figures dispite the flaw, but not all of them can do that.

Bazooka looks like he is going to be assigned to the dolly parton brigde, and Barbeque needs to diet (as does Slipstream). While ace and wild bill either need to hang on the back of a door to stretch thier arms or get whacked hard in the head to shink thier torsos (or both and meet in the middle).

So in sumation I love some and dispise others. each one is a case by case basis of my own opinion.

What about the guys like me who are always into new things and see the room for improvement? LIke, I could care LESS about the o-ring in concept BUT the fact that Hasbro didn't give us a SW-like swivel waist peg wasn't thought out well. To make the swivel and jointed ankles work, you gotta have a swivel thigh (think JvC Firefly).

The lack of head articulation in terms of looking up and down isn't as big a deal to me as the LACK OF ARTIULATION in the ARMS that most of these figures suffer from. AND the lack of Swivel Wrists, which we KNOW Hasbro can do, the lack of it sucks! The fact that the chest and stomach don't usually match up is a bummer too. Duke's shirt is off. I'da prefered, I guess, the o-ring cuz it'd fix that tiny problem of the torso lining up.

But the sculpting, for the most part, is top notch. They've given us a pretty large array of characters to choose from. Repaints work for me (like DTC LowLight, the Steel Brigade, Colton, etc) but the OVERUSE of characters for the repaints (or vice versa is a bit of a low point. How many ninja we got now??? Red, black, white and an upcoming aqua ninja??? I also like the amount of soft goods that have been added to the figures. Firefly for example. Instead of a molded on ammo belt, it's removable. Just like Beach Head and his vest. Very nice touch and it helps the costs with the figures (just add soft goods).

I'm FINE with the 25A. THey aren't the end all. But there's a lot of room for improvement.

And from what I've seen, most of the JBL seems to LOVE the 25A. A bit more than myself, tho that might not be saying much. I'm not sure WHY those guys love the 25A more than the bastard era. Maybe Frank can explain that one. All I can figure is that those guys are more traditionalist than Outrider in that we are getting UPDATED figures in (almost) ORIGINAL outfits. *shrug*

BTW, I may not be a fan of the old ARAH stuff, but man... If I had mad cash, I'd be buying DTC Blueshirts, VvV (red) Vipers and ST (blue) NeoVipers myself. THose are o-rings and I'd hit that. And also, I LIKE the VvV Cobra Commander (black w/ cape) and DTC Major Bludd better than their 25A counterparts.

It's not a matter of being a traditionalist G. I'm all for new stuff, especially new characters (which is one of the main reasons I buy the con sets), I just don't like the style of the 25th figures, or the larger size. I readily acknowledge their (few) good points such as the detailed sculpting and mostly cool accessories, but they have too many faults for me to buy them. The fact that they are "updates" of the original line makes me want them even less. Why buy the same characters, in the same outfits again? I wouldn't even do that if they were o-ring figures! :rolleyes:

See, that's my point. The traditionalists LOVE the fact that Hasbro updated the original outfits. I wasn't refering to a traditionalist being o-ring only. I know that a majority of the fans there were dying for the original outfits cuz they weren't in-love with the Bastard Era. I think they've gotten over the scale issues and I figure a lot of 'em are hardcore fans. And you know what 'hardcore' really means, right? ;)

Sorry G, I misunderstood your point when you referred to "traditionalist". :rolleyes: Oh, and I think I have a faint idea what "hardcore" really means... ;)

I don't like to discuss this topic, but maybe someone would like to read my 2 cents. I like the o-rings, but I love the o-rings on comic pack form. The ones who can hold any weapon w/o breaking a thumb :cool: . I wish I had seen more figures getting the treatment of the comic packs. I would like a Falcon v1 and some others that way. Of course the relaunch of the RAH in 2000/2001 made some woderful figures too.

Many people tell how poseable the 25th are and in parts it is true, however you can get real good poses from the old sculpts. People keep comenting on my pictures saying how good the poses are, but there are many here doing better than I, with the o-ringed figures.

I think sometime things change, like good TV series getting to an end. The bad thing about the 25th for me replacing the old ones, is to be on the wrong side. On the looser side, the o-ring lover side :(.

I am an oldie
 

I think I've made my opinions on 25th clear. I have nothing against O-ring figures. I like them, I have many that I don't ever plan to get rid of. But they look so... primitive and deformed next to their more proportionally correct 25th descendants! I like the 25th because of the superior sculpting, as has been mentioned before. I also dislike the chest swivel (though I do think it's getting better) and the dreaded Duke arms. But those are about the only things I dislike.

As far as the fact that they're basically rehashes of all the old figures... That's actually what I wanted the Joe revival in 2002 to be! I never owned v1s of a lot of the main Joes from the comics and cartoons, and getting them in an updated format is fantastic. In the year or so since 25th started, I think I've bought more of these figures than in the 4 or 5 years I was collecting JvC and its sequel lines!

Finally, I will say this-- If I still played with my Joes, I'm sure I would find the 25th figures too fragile. But I just display them on a shelf, and use them for dios, and that's about it. I tried displaying my RAH and JvC Joes, but they looked very primitive and silly next to all my nicely sculpted and highly articulated Marvel Legends and similar lines. However, I proudly display the 25th Joes because they're geared far more for that purpose.

I think that about covers my thoughts...