W.VA shootings........What spells 'Apocolypse' to you?

[General Scarlett]

It seems like such a 'off handed' comment, doesn't it?? I mean, we talk about all kinds of things here and there.....but when something like this happens, I can't help but try and see 'beyond the horizion'.

Society today is a myriad of contradiction. We have breakthroughs in medicine and science, and yet we still find ourselves mired deeply in the 'art of war'. We strain to teach the youth how to 'pay it forward' in the most positive ways, and yet things like this happen..........


http://www.cnn.com/2007/US/04/16/vtech.shooting/index.html


My heart, my prayers and my most fervent and sincere wishes for peace and change go out to any and all who are affected. Not just with this disgusting tragedy, but with whatever 'brush' people have with 'The Apocalypse'..............

http://i117.photobucket.com/albums/o47/PrncsLeia/DSC01506_edited.jpg

[Urban Saboteur]

[FONT=Arial]I noticed this too.. it was the top story on MSN today when I signed in earlier. This is a tradgic loss of life.[/FONT] :(

[Sonneilon]

I'm reading it off of yahoo now.

I'd like to think there's a logical explanation for this type of thing. It's more than just a guy going out and shooting people up. It's like, there's too many people in the world, more than in history. Sure, that's OBVIOUS but it's like, when a civilization becomes a certain size, this is simply part of nature? Like, did the Aztecs have nutty guys running around killing people? Were there people in Stalin's age that went postal?

I can't help but think that there are simply too many people in the world. There are problems not being properly addressed, people not attended to, media out of control, etc. We've had school shootings. We've had rave shootings. We had a guy shot in this lil liberal town of mine recently. It's just bizarre, to say the least. We ask what's wrong with those people. With the way the world is, it's not that hard to figure out. We just lack the proper coping mechanisms, as my mother would say.

[Urban Saboteur]

[FONT=Arial]The latest from MSNBC is that the person responsible is a male wearing a Maroon Hat and black jacket in his 20's.
Apparently he's killed 31 people and turned the gun on himself :(

This is such a sad day for humanity..[/FONT] :(

[ToneGunsRevisited]

I wouldn't say a "sad day for humanity". It's a sad for people who try to do the best to each other and who care for each other. This guy who shoot is (was, since he is dead) part of humanity and I don't think such a guy have a little care for nothing or for someone.

I let here my sincere hope that the ones who lost somebody on this big stupidity, can find a strong place under God's arms. My best wishes for them.

God bless them all.

[maxtype]

I see things like this tragedy and think-"our society is in free-fall-like the last days of the Roman Empire"................

But then I remember all the blessings in my life.................how lucky I am..............

[Outrider]

Sadly this sort of occurrence seems to be more and more common in the world we find ourselves in today, and not just in the USA. There have been too many instances like this even in the seemingly safe place I live in, Australia. Whether it is a symptom of a society in decline, or just a random acts by lone nutjobs makes no difference to the victims and their families. They have to deal with the intensely personal grief and anger at the injustice of their loved one's deaths. We can only imagine how heartbroken they are. It's so easy to forget that every single one of those victims was someone's treasured daughter or son or spouse or sibling etc, not a nameless statistic forgotten after a few days. May God bless the victims and their families, and may He protect us all from the sort of random, brutal, evil events that took place today. :confused: :(

[Fisher]

I am still awaiting a list of victim names, I have friends that attend there. Sad, senseless day.

[General Scarlett]

Latest news..........




http://www.nbc30.com/news/12236817/detail.html?treets=har&tml=har_natlbreak&ts=T&tmi=har_natlbreak_1_08390304172007

[Urban Saboteur]

[FONT=Arial]I'm still struggling to understand "why" whilst this maybe not the most important point of news.. I can't help but want to know a Motive for all of this stupidity.. there seems no clear indication or motive for the killings.[/FONT]. :confused:

[ender098]

[QUOTE=Urban Saboteur][FONT=Arial]I'm still struggling to understand "why" whilst this maybe not the most important point of news.. I can't help but want to know a Motive for all of this stupidity.. there seems no clear indication or motive for the killings.[/FONT]. :confused:[/QUOTE]


I think what you mean is you want to know what set this guy off. What chain of events or certain event in paticular caused this nutjob to jump the sanity fence. Saying you wanna "Understand why" is not what you wanna do. That implies that you can understand his reasoning and say "Oh! His Girlfriend was sleeping with another guy, that's why he felt compelled to gun down 32 people,ok! Well, I feel much better....off to bed!"

I think what you're trying to say is you want to find out if in his skewed perception of reality there was a reason he did what he did and not that he just woke up and said "Hey, what a great day to go on shooting spree. I think I'll start by blasting someone in the dorms and drive across campus to open fire in the classrooms" I just wonder what his objectives were. Was he looking for certain people?

I don't think any of us want to understand what drove him to this, because by understanding, we empathize with him and I'd rather it be a cold day in hell before I emapthize with someone who kills 33 people! I feel terrible for all the families who lost loved ones in this.


Here's my $.02.....how many people are gonna go protest at /and/or burn down the South Korean Embassy.....NONE, RIGHT?!! But we Infidels think all Middle Easterners are violent. If this had Happened in Syria or Jordan or Yemen, the South Koreans would be at war with the Arabs! I'm not saying this to make the point we should do something to the South Koreans, but rather that CIVILIZED nations don't do that kind of thing! And Arabs who get pissed because we call them violent because they do, need to take note of the interaction between the US and South Korea over this;


[quote="Yahoo News"]
SEOUL, South Korea - South Korea's Foreign Ministry said Tuesday the government hoped the Virginia Tech shootings, allegedly carried out by a 23-year-old South Korean native, would not "stir up racial prejudice or confrontation."

"We are in shock beyond description," said Cho Byung-je, a ministry official handling North American affairs. "We convey deep condolences to victims, families and the American people."

Earlier Tuesday before it emerged that the shooter was from South Korea, President Roh Moo-hyun offered his "deep condolences to bereaved family members and wished quick recovery of injured people," the president's office said in a statement.
[/quote]

See, this is how CIVILIZED people deal with issues...not by retaliating with suicide bombers and Jihad!! By Diplomacy and Good will.

[Mobius_1]

I heard that the old professor that died holding a door was a holocost (hope i spelled that right) survivor. he survived one of the worst happenings in human history, and to go out a hero is ,in my opinion, a great way to die. but i still hate the thought of dying.......

[ender098]

[QUOTE=ender098] Here's my $.02.....how many people are gonna go protest at /and/or burn down the South Korean Embassy.....NONE, RIGHT?!! But we Infidels think all Middle Easterners are violent. If this had Happened in Syria or Jordan or Yemen, the South Koreans would be at war with the Arabs! I'm not saying this to make the point we should do something to the South Koreans, but rather that CIVILIZED nations don't do that kind of thing! And Arabs who get pissed because we call them violent because they do, need to take note of the interaction between the US and South Korea over this;

See, this is how CIVILIZED people deal with issues...not by retaliating with suicide bombers and Jihad!! By Diplomacy and Good will.[/QUOTE]


Damn, the news made it sound like he was a foreign exchange student. He was a naturalized American. That's why I hate the media....they never check their facts before they throw them out there!

[yorktownjoe]

I pray for the families of the victims. Politicizing a viewpoint or speculating on the feelings of others during a time of mourning is rather distasteful. I'm not impressed with our American media in any way.

God knows that evil exists in this world because of sin. He is not unaware of senseless violence. He does care, and listens to prayer.

I pray that the families of those who lost their loved ones receive comfort and grace from Him in their time of need.

[Fantom]

I personally believe that these people that comit an act such as this are:

1) Suicidal (obviously)
2) Reaching out for attention
3) Want to be a martyr
4) Make a point of some sort

This person probably wouldn't have commited such an extreme act if others before him hadn't received such high profile news coverage and publicity. These people in a way become a part of history and get to be on TV. They get to exact their revenge, end their lives, make a public statement via recordings and suicide notes, and go down in history. A trend has been set, and as much as we try to prevent such a travesty, in the end efforts prove to be fruitless. Just like security forces in Iraq can't find a way to stop suicide bombers from blowing themselves up and killing dozens too hundreds of people, security at a campus has little power to stop a crazy from shooting up a school with automatic weapons. Definitely f'd up.

[Sonneilon]

I stated originally that the problem has to do with the lack of coping skills. Frankster mentioned this in his post in the JBL. People do things for numerous reasons; be it good reasons or bad. This guy was po'd at 'rich kids'. Maybe he got picked on for being Korean (Japanese love to pick on Koreans). Maybe he didn't roll in a Lexus or Infiniti. Maybe his grades weren't up to snuff w/ the rest of his class.

It's been stated in the news that the dude was pretty incoherent in the video he sent NBC. Sounds like he was high to me.

But here's the thing, that's life. For us old folks, we can see it pretty dang easily.

As GenScar and I were talking the other day, SHE has a lot of problems in life. She's got a flooded basement. She ain't go no job. There's other things. Weaker people would hit FEMA up for $$$ or simply go postal. That's a choice. GenScar COULD go do that but she knows better. She can deal with it better. I'm sure a lot of us have been in bad places at times, but have any of us gone and started shooting up the town?

It's my belief that (once again), there are too many people in the world. It's easier to fall thru the cracks. Peer pressure has to be even worse than it was in the, ahem, 50s. Or 60s. You all get the idea. Each generation things they have it the hardest. And maybe, just maybe, THIS generation of kids do. It's THIS generation of kids that have been called "The Entitlement Generation". They believe they don't have to work for anything and should be given whatever they want and that they DESERVE it! Work your way up thru a company? No way! They want full benefits, top of the line salary and lord knows what else.

A lot of THAT has to do with what's on tv these days. The concept of the 'reality' show has shown that the average joe can become a star. Shows like American Idol, Survivor and so-on only reinforce the dissolutionment amongst the kiddies. My mother had read that it's like, 70% of the kids today think they'll be famous. Don't get me started on sports stars and the fact that newspapers make STARS out of high schoolers.

In the end, I'm sure this guy is aware of other events that have occured and he must've said, "gee whiz, this is how you make a statement." From Columbine to the Capital Hill rave shooting (Seattle), it just gives these 'losers' more ideas. So instead of being the g'damn best he could be, he chose to go out the easy way. What a prick.

My thoughts go out to the families and the victims. My anger goes towards those who can't get their act together.

[Outrider]

[QUOTE=Sonneilon]As GenScar and I were talking the other day, SHE has a lot of problems in life. She's got a flooded basement. She ain't go no job. There's other things. Weaker people would hit FEMA up for $$$ or simply go postal. That's a choice. GenScar COULD go do that but she knows better. She can deal with it better. I'm sure a lot of us have been in bad places at times, but have any of us gone and started shooting up the town?

It's THIS generation of kids that have been called "The Entitlement Generation". They believe they don't have to work for anything and should be given whatever they want and that they DESERVE it! Work your way up thru a company? No way! They want full benefits, top of the line salary and lord knows what else[/QUOTE]

You raise some excellent points there G. Anyone that's been around the block a few times knows it isn't all plain sailing. We've all experienced difficult and stressful times, but we work through them and come out stronger on the other side. We cope because we have to, and because that's what normal people do.
I can also tell you you are also spot on with your observation on the "Entitlement Generation". I see it all the time with young kids we hire at work. Ask them to get their hands dirty and thay look at you like "Are you for real?" We've had kids leave after half a day! Of course there are exceptions, but to find a respectful kid who's prepared to start at the bottom is becoming harder every year.
There have always been unstable losers, but the in-your-face 24hr saturation media coverage, instant gratification and easy attitudes that prevail now seem to bring them out of the woodwork.

[Urban Saboteur]

[FONT=Arial]Theres well documented evidence to support the entitlement generation.
My bro in law works at a bank.. they got this young kid worker there last year.
He started on the monday morning .. went for lunch and never returned.. :confused: some kids today...they don't want to start at the bottom and work their way up the ladder!
Going back to the gunman Cho Seung Hui, it seems to me he was ''bullied'' from his own colleagues on campus.. I think this is really sad.. but this goes on.. you know I was bullied and picked on at school too.. but I got through it and toughed it out..
I think theres far worser things to happen in your life then bullying at school.. things like laying your grandparents to rest.. or your parents divorcing.. or even worse losing your best friend at the age of 24.
We all go through tough times.. I lost my friend I still toughed it out.. I dealt with it best way I could.. but NEVER did I ever contemplate doing what the gunman done.. okay so he couldnt deal with the bullying.. he mentioned in the media video he sent he could of left but he had to stay.... he knew he had options to leave and knew that killing those people was wrong...he probably committed suicide to stop the world of hurt he would feel after being locked up..it further confirms what a coward he is by actually killing himself after the shootings.. I agree with G.. this guy was a prick.. he took the cheap way out and how selfish he is for taking all that potential and positive life with him.
As far as I am concerned the world is short 1 more moron. The world is missing 32 other promising & dedicated people.
U.S[/FONT]

[Lava Boss]

There's something very wrong if young "adults" bully on campus. I mean, public school is over! (Not that it's okay there, either) You are supposed to be grown-up. Ridiculous. College was only ever work for me, but I never lived on campus. All this free time to be act like a @#$% is an alien concept.


What's frustrating about the Entitlement Generation, is that it crosses all class lines. It's not the just rich kids and middle class kids who just like that, it's the lower class as well. I mean, to the extent when people would rather become criminals and risk going to prison than get a job (They might have to dress like an adult then! :eek: ). Again, bad parenting and bad role models. I suppose every generation says that about the younger generation(s). And maybe they are right!

In Cho's case, he was mentally ill. Not all people are equal, stress can do horrible things to a person's mental state, and some will crack. It's hard to pity him, and maybe we shouldn't. (I really don't, but I've been desensitized by the media that I can barely feel sad for the victims. ) But we shouldn't let people off who poke a mad dog with a sharp stick, either...if that is the case. I actually haven't read much about the killer because...I almost actively avoid major media stories. I find it all irritating and/or depressing. My late grandma once said "Why watch the news, you can't change any of it." Which I thought was sooooo stupid at the time. Now, maybe she was right. :(

[Sonneilon]

That's totally what I was saying, Urban S! That's why I gave the example of GenScar whose got problems, but she's not going around shooting people!

And LavaBoss... I think we can all look back at the college days and say, "dang, those kids are really young. Trying to figure out their future, what they want in life, who they are..." Can that all really be done by the time your 22 or 23? Sure, there are a lot who can, but there are probably even more who can't. I think almost all the people I knew in college majored in 1 thing, ended up working an entirely different job!

The bullying thing, adults and college... Some of those colleges are extensions of high school. There was a rather large group that went to 1 of the public universities in Cali BECAUSE it'd be just like high school. But let's face it, the peer pressure is different in college. As Mobius has observed, it's about hobbies, clothes and music. In college, it's like, the beer you drink, the car you drive and what your major is.

But as Frank said, where were the parents in all this?

[ToneGunsRevisited]

I'm a Physics teacher in High School. What I can't say that US schools and brazilian schools aren't so diferent judging by what you are saying. Here the great problem is that the law is always on the students side. We, teachers, need to talk with students with open doors to don't get acussed of sexual siege or something like that. They don't need to show that they are ready for next grade, they have their rights granted to go to the next grade. What means that our words as adults and responsible teachers doesn't matter.

What I'm trying to say is kids have to many rights and no duties. They can think just about themselfs. We never had such a brutalitty, like wha Cho's did, going on here in Brazil. But we have violence of diferent types. It's sad to look things going this way.

I can understand Frank when he asks about the parents, we talked about childrens education in MSN sometime ago. But sometimes parents are tied by law to educate. I mean some laws doesn't support parents when they need to givet their childs some good lesson, I don't know if you got what I'm saying.

[Outrider]

[QUOTE=ToneGunsRevisited]What I'm trying to say is kids have to many rights and no duties. They can think just about themselfs.[/QUOTE]

You are absolutely right Luis. Unfortunately the prevailing attitude here too is that everyone screams for their rights, but nobody wants to know about ther responsibilities. It's the "victim" mentality; no-one will take responsibility for their own actions, and everyone blames their shortcomings or mistakes on others, or society in general. Combine that with a lack of respect for the law and for others that sadly permeates our youth here, and we are in serious decline.